Curse

Lunarhound · Feb 26, 2005, 07:58 PM // 19:58

I've seen a lot of questions about roleplaying in Guild Wars in various forums, and suggestions for ways to facilitate it. I'm a roleplayer myself, and I'd love to see some features implemented that would make it easy for roleplayers to find each other and play together without bugging non-RP'ers with IC spam in towns, or having to convince the devs to implement something that would take too much time away from core issues.

So, here's my suggestion. Something like it may have been suggested before, but if it has, I can't find it. What I would propose, is a sort of "IC chat mode". It would be toggled off by default, and would have to be turned on in the options menu. Once turned on, the "All" channel would be blocked in towns, and replaced with a "Say" channel that would work more like the say command in a typical mmorpg. Anything you said would only be broadcast to players in the immediate vicinity, and maybe the words would display above their heads (toggleable). In addition, while in this "RP mode" you'd see a flag over anyone's head who was also using it. This would keep RP spam out of everyone else's way, and allow RP'ers to easily identify each other. Taking away the ability to monitor the "All" channel would simply be a way to discourage people who didn't want to roleplay from entering RP mode. You'd still get the occasional griefer who'd toggle it on just to annoy people, but I don't think they'd last long, since they'd likely just end up being ignored and would get tired of crippling their chat.

And there you have it. RP is kept out of sight from everyone who doesn't want to see it, and roleplayers have an easy way to find and chat with each other in town without having to see everything else. What do you think?

Also, I've always wanted to see some sort of searchable "profile" feature in GW, with options to set info about yourself such as "PvPer" or "PvEer" or "RPer" "Currently Looking for Guild" etc. as well as a way to describe yourself. This would make it easy to find and meet exactly the kind of players you're looking for.

jaynan · Feb 26, 2005, 08:55 PM // 20:55

why not have anet just add a district for RP? you'll get the biggest concentration of like-minded people and only have to deal with the hopefully occasional griefers. this makes it easy for anet by avoiding the additional filters and any special flagging of characters. it could be easily (i think) implemented and might draw more roleplayers to the game.

-Jerry

"Work hard, rock hard, eat hard,
sleep hard, grow big, wear glasses if you need 'em!" -Webb Wilder

Lunarhound · Feb 26, 2005, 09:09 PM // 21:09

I thought of that, actually, and remember discussing it with some other people, but is it possible then thought that RP chat like this might be easier to implement. Maybe I'm wrong, but it seemed like a simpler idea. The easier something is to do, the more likely it is to get done.

Plus, a communication command with a limited range would be better for roleplaying since it would allow people to have individual conversations without the use of seperate channels and I think something like this would be a lot less likely to attract griefers. Another district is just another district, no matter what kind of label you put on it, and it would probably end up being not much different from the others, in the end. But creating an RP channel that's more restrictive than the normal channel (with the limited range, and the shutting out of "All") would probably be something that almost no one other than roleplayers would want to bother with for long.

jaynan · Feb 27, 2005, 04:52 AM // 04:52

OK, i see what you mean. i think your point about the district just becoming another district is accurate, especially since the game will probably dump anyone into the district at the end of a mission or if they are jumping from point to point. not a lot of discrimination there that i could tell from the BWE.

-Jerry

"Work hard, rock hard, eat hard,
sleep hard, grow big, wear glasses if you need 'em!" -Webb Wilder

Dragonne · Feb 27, 2005, 05:24 AM // 05:24

Well if it's a separate district group like the International Districts, it wouldn't work that way. You'd have to select it to get in there, and it would keep returning you there once you chose it once (at least until you chose to leave it).

I think that would be the best implementation. I know it was kinda wierd and even a bit funny to see the RPers in normal chat between the trading chatting.

Myself, I love RPing, but always thought the idea of RPing in text was a joke. The more I see it, the more I think that. RPing to me has always been a voice relative thing. If you can't talk to the other RPer it doesn't work. Voice comms would be required at a minimum for it to work, but of course this is the internet and so many of the female RPers are likely "odd" males (for lack of a better term) that someone setting up an RP Teamspeak or Ventrillo server and getting reasonable participation is highly unlikely.

Lunarhound · Feb 27, 2005, 06:18 AM // 06:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragonne

Myself, I love RPing, but always thought the idea of RPing in text was a joke. The more I see it, the more I think that. RPing to me has always been a voice relative thing. If you can't talk to the other RPer it doesn't work.

It's funny you should say that, because most of the RP'ers I've run across seem to think the exact opposite. They're of the opinion that voice completely ruins roleplaying because it destroys the illusion, and that text is the only good way to go about it.

Anyway, whether you have to select the RP districts seperately or not, I still think they'd end up becoming just like the others before long, because they operate just like the others. Making it an actual seperate chade mode that's more limited than the normal one would better prevent people who don't want to roleplay from abusing it. Plus, the way "All" chat works in towns just isn't very good for RP. Seeing everyone in town talking at once, no matter where they are, just isn't going to work when people are going to want to have seperate conversations in different locations all over the city.

On top of all that, it's probably the simplest thing to implement, which would increase the likelhood of it actually being put in.

Avatin · Feb 27, 2005, 11:17 AM // 11:17

[SIZE=3]As in reality where it is impossible to speak to everyone in your city (hopefully !

can you imagine that !), i agree that a voice range limit would increase the role play feeling

However, I think that even if Arena Net implement a viable trade system, the "all" chat mode cannot be thrown away and replaced by that "limited range" chat mode you are talking.

In fact, the "all" chat mode can be very useful in cities. For example, it is very funny for a french speaking person as I am to be able to ask an entire city (as Ascalon or Lion's Arch) if there is other french players who would like to chat with me, to team up, and so forth.

Of course, Arena Net could maybe just add a new tab in the chat. So you would have : All - Area - Team - Guild tabs. But if every french people are actually in "Area" mode, how will I find them then? Who will hear me? Nobody.

While playing missions, it happens quite often that some people get lost, and sometimes you dont see them on the minimap. So, imagine you are lost, you want to get help or want to find your teamates, but nobody hear you because every other players are in "area" chat mode.... That kind of moments are confusing enough....

Anyway. Some would say: If you are lost it is normal that you cannot be heard. This is true Role Play. Next time, try to stay grouped, try to stay near.

I'd answer to it we dont want to loose people while involved in missions. As this game is an instanced one, when you start a mission, you hope everyone will stay in. With an "area'" chat mode, I think there is chance your team can be separated and you see players quit the game because they were tired of being lost.

But anyway, I think this area chat feature is a good enough idea to spend some time wondering how it could be added.

Sorry for the long text, maybe I'd better go write some novel or something .

[/SIZE]

Lunarhound · Feb 27, 2005, 04:06 PM // 16:06

The idea wouldn't be to replace "All" with the limited range chat, but to have a certain chat mode you could toggle on that would block out "All" when you go into it. Yes, "All" has plenty of uses, but if you want to use it, you can choose to keep the limited range chat toggled off. The limited range would only be for when you want to roleplay. The reason for blocking out "All" while it's on would be to keep people who don't really want to roleplay from using it.

As for missions, I don't think this would need to be implemented outside of towns. If you're in a private instance with other roleplayers, there's no one around to interrupt you, so there's no real reason to have a system that blocks out "All". Cities and outposts would be the only place that something like this would really be needed.

Mslynx · Feb 28, 2005, 12:47 AM // 00:47

I like the thought of area chat. There were times when I was separated from my party,permenently, because they needed to map to town. If they were on a area channel, that transended districts, we would have been able to find each other again.
Also, perhaps they will implement a /disband command. Just because you need to trade or unload your inventory, you should not automatically be disbanded from your group.

Vaelin · Feb 28, 2005, 01:35 AM // 01:35

I like your idea a lot Lunarhound. I posted a similar suggestion in the suggestions forum a couple of days ago. I think it would greatly enhance the role playing aspects of the game. As it stands right now, the role playing is difficult if impossible due to the area wide chat system.

I agree that there should be a seperate "role playing tab". That way people who want to roleplay can do so without the constant interruptions or people trading and sending out thousands of dance emotes. The people that want to role play can just go to the role play tab, and the people that don't want to can just stay on the "All" tab. Both parties are happy and both have ways to enhance their play style.

Vaelin

Avatin · Feb 28, 2005, 05:42 AM // 05:42

Ok for the mission, we would not need that feature there.

I am coming back with my precedent example:

Since it is an international game, I am german (for example) and there are three other german people inside the city. I dont speak a word of english. So finding german people is an important issue for me. The three other german people are at the opposite side of the city, they play together, and they all have the "area" chat mode toggled 'on', they are trading with NPCs. So the fact is : I have to run all around the city, holding "I am german do you want to play with me" sentence over my head, hoping to be seen. Is the role play enhancement worth it? Is it better to live situations of that sort instead of suffering the "all" chat mode?

Could we maybe find another way to improve the "all" chat mode? Maybe just remove the /emotes from being written in the chat would help. Maybe to put an easy feature to silence sellers and buyers? Maybe the expected new trade system will completely clean the chat ?

I am just trying to fuel the debate.

[COLOR=DarkRed]Or, you know, as it existed in Diablo II (remember the "!" in chat if you ever played), what if I simply get a message over the head when I type "&" (or anything else) before my message?[/COLOR]

Actually, if I remember well, "!" is all mode, "#" is team mode, and what is the guild one? "@"?

For example, I am in "all" chat mode, but I type "&Is there any german people here to play with me? (free translation from German

) So you get a message in chat that everybody can read, but you also get that sentence over the head, so that a German player near you can see your message over you head?

You could either type "!& your message"
and why not "#& your message" : a team message plus message over head
and "@& your message" : a guild only message with message over head.

O please devs please give me that "message over head" feature, pleeeeeeeeaaaaazzzzzzzzz!

March Hare · Feb 28, 2005, 06:17 AM // 06:17

That would be great assuming you can still toggle this on or off. Though it might still get confusing if there are too many. But overall a verrrrrrrry good idea.

Lunarhound · Feb 28, 2005, 06:26 AM // 06:26

Is the language thing really an issue? I was under the impression that you could choose to go to districts containing people who all have the same language settings as you.

Even if that isn't the case (yet) there are ways around it. Have a player's language setting display on mouseover, or even allow a "language flag" toggle. There are plenty of possible ways to show what language people are speaking and still be able to implement something like this.

Avatin · Feb 28, 2005, 07:56 AM // 07:56

A flag language or something like that is an interesting idea.

Actually the international districts are mostly inhabited. Each time a tried to go to an international one of course. I have my own language setting turned to french, but my char is automatically directed into "local" places.

Will it be different in the release version?

The language problem have been touched upon in another thread about listening/non listening players : http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/showthread.php?t=342

Anyway I like it very much, the idea of being able to put words over my head. The sentence could maybe be readable only from predetermined distance, for example 50 feet.

/!& bye bye!

efiloN · Feb 28, 2005, 08:39 AM // 08:39

Anyone heard anything about the translation software for Guild Wars Jeff Strain talked about in the Filefront interview?
He said something about chat being translated from german/french and so on to english or vice versa.

Taken from filefront:
Q: So a guy talkin’ crap in French will be translated into English?

A: That’s… yeah. We’ll do auto-translation. But that required a substantial amount of engineering work on our behalf right up front. So we spent a good couple of years building all of these technologies that we needed to pull this off. And then of course we turned our focus to the game content itself. We built an absolutely world class art team and world class design team. We have James Finney who was the lead designer of Starcraft, and have spent the last couple of years bringing the gameplay into existence around all this technology.

Sorry about the slightly off topic.

Avatin · Feb 28, 2005, 12:52 PM // 12:52

I was not aware of that auto-translation feature Efilon. What a fantastic thing if it works well!

IceD'Bear · Feb 28, 2005, 01:15 PM // 13:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by efiloN

Anyone heard anything about the translation software for Guild Wars Jeff Strain talked about in the Filefront interview?

Yes, we heard of it - the interview is utter crap and not true at all, they were never planing on making a translation tool.

Aladdar · Feb 28, 2005, 02:29 PM // 14:29

I'm a huge roleplay geek, I'm involved in a few DnD campaigns right now. I've tried roleplaying in MMORPG's before and just find the experience too limiting. I'm definitely not opposed to anyone trying to RP in this game and if you can find a way to do it, by all means go ahead. I've just always found myself disapointed because my character is so limited.

The only game I've ever been able to play and feel like I'm roleplaying is NeverWinter Nights since you can have a DM running a campaign. To me nothing will ever beat pen and paper role playing. I've accepted Guild Wars as what it is. However if you can find some great roleplaying in it, let me know and I'll give it a shot.

Mumblyfish · Feb 28, 2005, 02:55 PM // 14:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aladdar

I've just always found myself disapointed because my character is so limited.

How so? I've tried roleplaying in every MMO I've dabbled in, and with great success. Well, apart from Final Fantasy XI. You know what the FF fanbase is like. "HAHA LOL ROLEPLAY LOLLERGAY I LVL NOW," usually spammed by someone with a name like Sephirothx. Or Cloudstrifex. Or Cloudsephirothx. You get the idea. Rant over. But how is your character limited? Your character has no limitations, beyond appearance. What you say ingame, what your actions are defines your character, not your height or profession combination.

Aladdar · Feb 28, 2005, 03:50 PM // 15:50

I just feel limited based on what the game gives me. I had some success in EQ way back when because the game was open, but I still couldn't effect anything in the universe really. I feel even more limited with that in this game as we're pretty much on rails. Yes, I can go through the explorable areas, but that's all. I can do the missions, but roleplaying with great immersion is a little tough in this game. I can't go to a bar and get drunk, I can't pick up women, I can't be the evil guy, I can't be the rebel, or overthrow an evil king (unless it's designed in a mission.)

I think it's very hard to get an immersion near the level of immersion I can get in a pen and paper game without having a human DM running a game.